Dušan Ignjatović and Natasa Ćuković Ignjatović: Knowing the context is key

Interview with Prof. Dr. Dušan Ignjatović (1968, Belgrade) and Prof. Dr. Natasa Ćuković Ignjatović (1969, Chaussées)
Belgrade, September 12, 2023
Interview conducted by: Dr. Nebojša Antešević

How did your first engagements in Africa come about? Did you have any previous connections with Africa, did you travel to any of the countries where you were later engaged before? If not, what are the sources from which you learned about the context? Is it important/necessary to know the context from personal experience – both for the design process and for implementation?

Like most such engagements, it all started quite by chance: there was a need to “urgently” create a proposal for the interior of the post office counter in a few days, which we did. The proposal was well received, later implemented, and then requests for other projects from the same investor began to appear, so that the circle of clients slowly expanded. The initial design team consisted of Dušan Ignjatović, Vojislava Popović, Nataša Ćuković Ignjatović and Dejan Vasović, under the leadership of Zoran Kilibarda, and later the number of participants increased significantly.

The entire engagement was initially “remote” through an intermediary, and only then did the opportunity arise to go to Gabon, and later my colleagues went to Equatorial Guinea, where we had the opportunity to see the locations of the facilities on site, get acquainted with the environment and the local cultural framework.

We received most of the initial information from our colleague Zoran Kilibarda, a civil engineer, who hired us and represented our “employer”, and who at that time had worked in Gabon and surrounding countries for almost twenty years, primarily in construction work, and then in design. We gathered other information from available sources: literature and from conversations with other colleagues who had previously worked in Africa.

Knowing the context is crucial, primarily for understanding the framework and modalities of design: concepts, materials, technology…, because they are very different from our previous experiences. Common questions, such as the meaning of modernity or technological complexity, can be interpreted quite differently and we ourselves have experienced the diversity of approaches and understandings. During the implementation, special challenges arise primarily related to the availability of materials, construction technology, workforce (training), but also future maintenance and repairs, which in the context in which we worked represent an important aspect of the design process.

How What was it like to land your first deals in Africa? Who were your first investors? Did the projects win international competitions or tenders?

The contracting issue was implemented by the local company “CEE Engineering” and later “CIGESA“, both owned by Mr. Kilibarda, who appeared on the market as a company providing a complete service from conceptual solutions to turnkey implementation.

We, as a team, did not participate in classic architectural competitions, but we did participate in bidding processes for investment projects where bidders offered a complete service from design to implementation, while providing project insurance, which represents a different approach to the investment implementation process.

It is known that Serbian firms have achieved notable results in architectural and urban projects in Africa since the 1960s – were you familiar with the work of our architects in Africa in the last century and did those references from architects from Serbia and Yugoslavia influence your work in any way, perhaps primarily in terms of the confirmed credibility of our experts?

Like all younger designers at the time, we were familiar with the previous experiences and achievements that our designers and companies had achieved in Africa. I first worked at “Energoprojekt”, which had achieved a significant amount of work in Africa, and that is how I was familiar with previous experiences.

The quality of the projects and the work performed, which is not limited to architectural structures but also to infrastructure systems and installations, has certainly “paved” the way for the further work of our experts in Africa. The good “image” of our experts is still present, even though a lot of time has passed and a large number of companies either no longer exist or are not as active in the local markets.

In just under fifteen years, you have developed around fifty projects for buildings of various types and sizes/complexities – how different was the working method and design process – from conceptual to construction project – in African countries compared to your experiences in Serbia?

In terms of the design method, we can say that the phases are similar, with minor “paperwork” restrictions in the conceptual design phase, but with significant participation of insurance companies in the implementation phase, which control the quality of documentation and monitor the progress of construction.

On the other hand, the amount of “changes” to project documentation, which is very common in our conditions and where we are often in a situation where we radically change (redesign) already agreed projects, is significantly smaller and is mainly related to technological or material aspects of the project, or to some unforeseen circumstances.

What did the design process look like – from the analysis of the location, urban conditions, if and to what extent they existed in relation to our planning practice, to the application of local regulations and technical standards, drawings and visualizations?

Urban conditions are noticeably simpler and mainly include basic parameters related to the position and volume of the building, i.e. infrastructure, fire protection and traffic conditions. Local technical regulations and standards are common and in accordance with generally accepted rules of the profession with minor differences that did not unduly condition the design process.

Information about the location varied significantly depending on their type: in urban areas we had all the necessary data available with precise project tasks, while in rural areas we only received a picture of a newly “paved” road through the jungle with the information that the “location for the church is next to the road” and that it would have to be “built in a few days”…

In terms of the content of the technical documentation, it is identical to ours with minor differences that were not difficult to adopt and implement. An interesting aspect is the visualization of future buildings, because they were locally understood as “construction”: namely, the degree of reality of the visualizations had to be significant so that the realized object would fully correspond to the renders, down to the smallest detail.

How much and in what ways did working on projects for state/public facilities (public services) differ from working with private investors in African countries?

Given that we were not in direct contact with the investors, it is difficult to assess the degree of diversity of the requirements of these groups of investors. The common denominator in all the projects in which we were involved is that most often the architectural project is only part of the “total offer” which, as a rule, also included implementation, which significantly “seriousens” the process for all participants, which is not the practice in our country.

What could you say/highlight regarding the project implementation – what was the communication like with the responsible contractor and craftsmen, what did the procurement of materials entail, or were you, as designers, involved in that process at all?

From the above, it is clear that the entire design and construction process is different than in our country and is much more focused on the final product – the completed facility. This is precisely why the possibilities for experiments in the design phase are quite limited, because, for example, future maintenance is part of the basic design requirements and must be considered in the concept formation phase. Our first projects represented an adaptation to these requirements, which also influenced the selection of materials, construction technologies and equipment. In relation to the climatic characteristics – high temperatures, humidity and significant precipitation with a relatively low technological level of local industry, a large number of material and technological solutions characteristic of European practice could not be applied.

The materialization decisions, given the type of “service” the company that hired us provided, were made in accordance with the possibilities of implementation. Initially, we had to change certain aspects of the concept (form, materialization, details and certain technological solutions), however, we quickly perceived all the aforementioned specificities and further, already in the concept phase, created solutions that could be “certainly” implemented. The company that hired us also expanded the scope of its activities by purchasing the necessary equipment and mastering new technologies necessary for the implementation of the facilities, which greatly facilitated the process.

Is our professional community interested in the work of Serbian architects abroad? Is the design and construction of buildings by our architects in Africa followed by the professional community there? Are there any announcements in daily newspapers and professional magazines, blogs?

While working on projects implemented in Africa, we had the opportunity to exhibit them at the Belgrade Architecture Salon several times, and some of the projects were also exhibited in neighboring countries, so we can say that there is a possibility of “communication” with the public, but then it is the result of personal initiative, not systemic.

As for the local promotion of the facilities, it is mainly related to media announcements in local print and electronic media. Some buildings are intended for state bodies (ministries, courts, banks, churches), so their opening was adequately covered.

No further promotion in terms of websites or blogs was carried out.

Have you collaborated with local or national associations and societies of architects in the countries where you worked? Have you established cooperation between then and now associations, societies, organizations, educational institutions? Have you collaborated with local design offices in African countries?

Personally, I have not had the opportunity to communicate with many other bureaus active locally, except for those who were more or less involved in the projects we worked on. Given the relatively short period, just over ten years, in which we worked in Gabon and Equatorial Guinea and the large number of projects and realizations, our engagement was very intense and left no room for other types of contacts.

In your opinion, can the African market continue to be attractive for our designers? For what reason?

I believe that in the context of global changes, this market is very interesting and represents great potential. On the one hand, it is an opportunity to continue the good cultural and economic relations that we once established, and on the other hand, to market our knowledge, experience and skills, which are great and very much needed and desired locally.

According to personal experience, the relationship of our designers and companies towards the local environment and investors is professional, partnership-based, with mutual understanding and respect, which is often not the case with experts from other countries.