Interview with Dr. Zoran Marković (1958, Niš)
Belgrade, Novi Sad and Gaborone (Botswana), August 1, 2023
The interview was conducted by: Dr. Nebojsa Antešević, Ilija Gubić
While preparing an exhibition about the work of architects from Serbia in African countries, we found a number of useful information and new insights in your biography, so in this conversation, could you tell us about the circumstances of your arrival in Botswana, how long have our architects been present in Botswana, what jobs have they worked on, what are your experiences, and did the experiences of “Energoprojekt” and other Yugoslav companies that worked in Africa help you in your work or were they useful in some way?
Thank you for talking and for reaching out – it is rare for someone to appreciate the work of architects from Serbia who live and work outside their homeland. You mentioned that your project is conceived in time from the time of independence to the present day – certainly since the beginning of the sixties, a large number of our experts have worked on projects in African countries, however, we should not forget the period before independence, when a certain number of architects from Serbia worked first in South Africa, but also in Ethiopia and Congo. We should also explore that with a project. That is what I wanted to say first. Africa is a very specific context. It is little known that, for example, a former minister in the Government of Gabon graduated in architecture from the Faculty of Technical Sciences of the University of Novi Sad. We in the profession, even if we don’t hang out much, know who works where and on which projects.
With a population of about two million, Botswana is the size of Vojvodina, although it is similar in area to France, i.e. with about 600,000 square kilometers it is three times larger than the former Yugoslavia. However, the capital and its surroundings are inhabited by only about 50,000 people, of whom only 20,000 live in the capital. I have been in Botswana for 27 years and we can talk about my experiences and the projects of our architects in Botswana, because I can talk about it, I have direct experience and knowledge. There were certainly other fellow architects in Botswana before. I did not come here through large firms, such as “Energoprojekt”, like most architects, nor in some solo adventure in the nineties, as a certain number of our fellow citizens decided to do at the time. Botswana was looking for experts for its government projects, I applied and got the job. I have been living and working in Botswana since March 1995. When I arrived, there were quite a few architects and other engineers from Serbia here. Energoprojekt withdrew from the market in those years, only one subsidiary remained – United Consulting, which worked on several smaller projects. The company was run by Marjana Strugar, an urban planner by profession, who was its director until the end of the 1990s. After her, the director of United Consulting was Nikola Ban. Vlada Stanojevic and other colleagues were also there. Many young architects came to United Consulting in those years, especially when the new urban plan for Gaborone was being worked on. Earlier, during the 1970s and 1980s, Energoprojekt was active in Botswana, however, for a number of different reasons, Energoprojekt focused on projects in Zambia. Large infrastructure projects were being carried out there. During that period, Energoprojekt attempted to expand into Botswana on several occasions, but a large number of architects left the firm and founded their own private companies, with which they competed in the market.
Who are our most prominent architects who worked in Botswana in the 1990s?
In my opinion, of our architects of that time, Ivan Pantić left the greatest mark on Botswana. Then, Konstantin Mandić also had a notable construction career, working on projects for stadiums, multi-storey buildings and various public buildings. Individual residential construction dominates in Botswana. Over 90% of people live in single-family houses, and residential multi-family buildings, of which there are not many, are up to four stories high. The post office building is 11 stories high and was for a long time the tallest building in the country. Nikola Ban is an architect who dealt with the city and left a deep mark on the urbanism of this country.
What jobs did you work in Botswana?
I worked in the Government of Botswana on construction and urban planning matters. I also worked on organizing tenders for the execution of projects within the Ministry of Public Works, which had an impressive department for architecture and urban planning. That work was not creative, so after completing my three-year contract with the Government, I went into design. First, I worked for several years as a designer, and then as a lecturer at the University of Botswana. After working at the University, I joined the private sector again. Then, in 1997, 1998, about ten of our architects and nine civil engineers arrived, most of whom stayed in administrative positions in the Government of Botswana for quite a long time. Some of them returned to Serbia or continued their work in other countries – Australia, New Zealand or the Emirates.
How would you describe the context of Botswana from the perspective of urbanization and construction?
Earlier, in the 1970s and 1980s, there were big projects here, but not many. The construction boom was from 1990 to 2002. At the time of independence from Great Britain, only 6% of the population was literate. It was enough for someone to have completed primary or secondary school to be a teacher. Due to such circumstances, the British granted independence to Botswana without knowing that the country had diamond deposits that were discovered in the 1970s. Unlike Congo, which is still at the same level of development as it was in the 1960s when Patrice Lumumba was assassinated due to poor leadership, Botswana’s development is due to the former diaspora educated in England and South Africa, where the colleges in Kuruman and Fraserburgh should be particularly noted, which leaned towards social democracy and invested in the development and modernization of the country using funds from mining rents and the sale of diamonds. There is no village in Botswana without water and electricity. All settlements with more than 500 people have a school and a police station. Cities and villages are classified by category. Thus, from 1966 to 1994, Botswana went from being one of the poorest countries in the world to being a moderately developed country. Today, the gross national income per capita is higher than in Serbia. At a time of great investment, when stadiums, roads, schools and hospitals were being built, there were several of our architects in the country. Unfortunately, in the late 1980s, the AIDS epidemic occurred, which plunged Botswana into a major health and financial crisis that threatened a sudden loss of population. Over 63% of the population was infected with AIDS at the time. Then, in 2002, the then Deputy Prime Minister carried out a so-called economic coup d’état and all the money earmarked for construction was transferred to healthcare, namely to the purchase of AIDS drugs. At that time, every resident was provided with free drugs, which were extremely expensive at the time – a weekly dose cost several hundred dollars. The number of infected people decreased over time and today is less than 16% of those affected, who, thanks to drugs to raise and maintain immunity, lead almost normal lives. During the 1990s and early 20th century, construction picked up again. After the Great Depression of 2008, investments began to return, but not at the same level as in previous years. You can see how natural resources, health care, and some global circumstances affected the construction sector.
Did experts from other countries also work for the ministry you worked for, or for other national or local authorities?
There have been many engineers from India, who have been coming to Botswana since the 1970s. They work either for the government or for the private sector. Experts from China have been coming since 2000, mainly those who work for their large state-owned companies. As for engineers from African countries, most of them are from South Africa and Kenya. There is still a significant number of English.
Did your experience in the Botswana Government help you later in your design career?
It was and was not useful. The biggest benefit of working for the government is to learn the English work system, which is different from Serbia. Foreign experts, including our citizens, tried to change and change Botswana in themselves, but they did not succeed, and they even left the construction sector. While there were many projects and implementations, there was no need for connections or special recommendations, because there was work for everyone. But, when the number of projects decreased recently, especially during the coronavirus pandemic, a large number of architectural and construction firms were in trouble. Many closed their firms, and some left the country. Those who ran bureaus during the pandemic managed to survive thanks to some small jobs. Many gave up architecture.
When you were designing in Botswana, did you work alone or did you team up with colleagues from Serbia or local architects?
On one or two projects I had architectural collaborators, but I did everything else related to architecture myself. Of course, structural engineers, road engineers, urban planners, landscape architects worked on all of those projects, but I did the architecture myself. The technicians developed the projects and drew them.
Many of the projects you have worked on are related to Botswana’s architectural heritage. What can you tell us about that?
The Built Heritage Act in Botswana dates back to 1938, during the British rule, but it was not sufficiently respected. Everything that is done in Botswana and is related to the built heritage goes through the national museum. Before independence, or rather before 1966, there was only one small private museum run by Campbell, who donated his collection to Botswana after independence with the desire to build a museum to house the collection. In the 1970s, the Norwegian government donated a museum project to Botswana, and it was built by “Energoprojekt”. Within that museum, there was a department for the protection of built heritage objects, however, there were no experts who would work in that department and improve the protection sector. What anatomy is to medicine, the history of architecture and art is to architecture, both in terms of importance and in terms of the difficulty of study. Botswana even sent its people to study in the field of architectural heritage protection, but they stayed abroad, or switched to studies in other areas of architecture. Only now, after 2020, two colleagues should specialize in the history of architecture and heritage protection. Since this is a subject that I love, it was also the field in which I received my master’s degree at the University of Belgrade – Faculty of Architecture, and my doctorate at the Faculty of Technical Sciences, University of Novi Sad, I tried to transfer this knowledge to students in Botswana when I worked in teaching. I was the first in Botswana to be accredited in 2002 for the reconstruction and revitalization of cultural objects under protection, including those on the UNESCO World Heritage List.
What would you highlight from your work and engagement in Botswana, what are you most proud of, what would you like to see displayed at the exhibition in Belgrade?
Personally, I believe that an architect should not be one-sided. I worked in the administration for the Government of Botswana, and then as a designer, a lecturer at the university and as a researcher on scientific projects. If someone is only a designer, that is too specialized. I have tried to work and prove myself in all these areas. What I would like to highlight from the realization is certainly the large shopping mall in Sarov. I designed that building before 2000, and today the younger generation of architects are taking over some of the ideas and using them in their projects, such as curved facades. Unfortunately, for a number of reasons, including politics, the building was not built. The shopping mall in Sarov is aesthetically different from what can be seen in the country. Then, I would also highlight my scientific research work. I have published more than ten studies in the form of monographs for the national museum. Namely, for buildings that are protected, a certain type of study must be carried out before any intervention can begin – this is exactly what I managed to introduce as a by-law and I am most proud of it. Within the framework of my work on the protection of cultural heritage and local architecture, I would like to highlight the project for the ethnographic village in Ditlvane, near the capital Gaborone. It is not common for a foreigner to work on a national ethnographic village project, but I had the opportunity and honor. In addition, my teaching experience is also significant, where I helped young people understand what architecture is.
Before going to Botswana, you had an accomplished design career in Serbia. Were those projects different from the ones you later worked on in Botswana?
I believed, unlike most of my colleagues, that a building should not depict “me”, the author, but rather the person who uses the building, and that the place and time of its construction can be read from it. As an architect, I do not erect a monument to myself, but rather help people live better lives – that is my principle. The climate here is different than in Europe or North America. For example, to transfer a building from Germany here to Botswana would be an architectural crime in my opinion. Such a building can be both modern and “fancy”, and perhaps the project enables a good income for the architect, but to be objective, some people have to live or work in that building, or use it, whether it is a school, a kindergarten, an apartment, a house, a factory or a bridge. For example, building a bridge on the Danube or the Morava is one thing, but building a bridge on a river in Botswana, which only has water in its bed for two months a year, and when it does, it is so strong that it can carry away the concrete pillars of the bridge – that is quite another. If you do not accept a different approach, that is, the local context, your architecture cannot be considered successful. Designing in Botswana is different even than in some other countries in Africa. Botswana is a semi-desert country that has two seasons: dry with low temperatures without rain for several months and rainy with high temperatures lasting six to eight months. So the climate and rainfall pattern here are quite different than in Uganda, Rwanda, Kenya, Burundi or Congo. For example, a building from Rwanda could hardly stand in Gaborone. If I were to “transfer” a building from here to Rwanda – people would consider me a bad architect, because I don’t meet the requirements of Rwanda, that climate. An architect should give his stamp, but he shouldn’t stick to it all the time – wherever and whatever he does, because that building of his will outlive him and other people will use it. I worked on a church project in Niš. The question is whether I will enter it or not, although I am always proud of my work when I pass by the building, the church was built for people to use and the only thing that matters is whether they, the users, are satisfied. If the users of that building don’t feel encouraged to think religiously, then I am a bad architect. It’s nice to design a monument, to make a big flat square around it, made of concrete, a big fountain, but people will remember that author as a good architect. It’s not difficult to create a huge building or public space, but people remember good deeds, not those that are imposing in size and area.
You are a member of the Botswana Association of Architects. How is the architectural profession organized in Botswana?
In short, one could say – poorly. The way the architectural profession is organized in Botswana reminds me of how it was organized during the breakup of Yugoslavia, where more care was taken to make a name for one of the colleagues who led the organization – so that they would have more work in the profession, than anything else that the association was supposed to serve. I remember that in Serbia, in the late 1980s, we tried to organize a series of lectures for all architects in Serbia, and when we saw that three or four colleagues came per lecture, we gave up. We also tried to activate students, but that didn’t work either. The same is true now in Botswana. In Botswana, a lecture is organized once or twice a year. About 30% of the membership comes to the lecture if it is in the capital. When we decided one year to hold the annual meeting of the Association of Architects outside Gaborone, only 12 people confirmed their attendance, because the majority of our fellow architects, almost 80%, live and work in the capital. I gave ideas, invited people, however, it is difficult to organize the profession. It seems that the Association of Architects is divided by ethnicity, i.e. colleagues from Kenya stick together, colleagues from England separately, Hindus have their own gatherings, etc. Ten years ago there were public lectures, mainly on the topics of protecting cultural and architectural heritage.
How many students enroll in architecture studies at the University of Botswana each year?
Botswana has a quality state university with eight faculties, one of which is the Faculty of Engineering and Technology, something like the Faculty of Technical Sciences at the University of Novi Sad. Both faculties are mammoths in terms of departments – scientific disciplines and the number of students and lecturers, and could become technical universities in their own right. The entire University of Botswana has over 1,000 lecturers and about 25,000 students. The Faculty of Engineering and Technology has architecture and urbanism studies that admit about a dozen students per year. There are other state and private universities that offer architecture and urbanism programs, some of which are specialized (architectural technology, interiors, etc.), some of which educate students only up to the level of high school.
When you taught architecture students in Botswana, did you use examples of architecture and good practices from Serbia?
We in Serbia have exceptionally good architecture, dating back to the time of the Kingdom of Serbia, then the Kingdom of Yugoslavia – these periods have been neglected in research, all the way to Yugoslav brutalism, which had its own exhibition at the Museum of Modern Art in New York. I taught the history of architecture, the history of art, aesthetics, interiors and practical research. For the subject Practical Research, or research in practice, students did a comparative study with examples from several countries, one of the students researched buildings in Zambia that were built by architects from “Energoprojekt”. Our architecture is not insignificant on a global scale. On a global level, Serbian and Yugoslav architecture are respected. I have also been to universities in Japan, Egypt, and India – as a guest lecturer or as part of international congresses and conferences, students knew about architecture in Serbia, and importantly, buildings outside Belgrade. I would be happy to help you prepare an exhibition on the work of Serbian architects in Africa. There are colleagues who deserve to be remembered, because if they are remembered in Botswana, it is a shame that they have been erased from architectural histories and reviews in Serbia. I am not only thinking of the forgotten colleagues Mandić and Pantić, who are the biggest names in Botswana architecture in the 1970s and 1980s and whose influence is immeasurable, but also of colleagues Nikola Ban, Marjana Strugar and Per Nastic, as well as many others who have left an impact on urban planning and design in Botswana. There are more colleagues and more buildings that have contributed to the development of Botswana.
